Why a 5th Theme Park Will NOT Be Built at Disney World in the Next Decade
Fans are hopeful that Walt Disney World will build a 5th theme park given the billions of dollars the company plans to invest on expansion in Florida. This makes the pessimistic prediction that a fifth gate won’t come to WDW any time soon…and shouldn’t! Here’s why it won’t happen, what we’ll get instead at Magic Kingdom and beyond, and why that’s better for fans. (Updated June 1, 2024.)
This is a topic that has been discussed to death by Walt Disney World fans for a while. As soon as Animal Kingdom opened, people began looking to the future again at what would come next. To some degree, this was understandable. California Adventure and Tokyo DisneySea both opened a few years later, with new parks in Paris, Hong Kong, and Shanghai after that. All offered amazing attractions and lands that Walt Disney World fans would love to see in Florida.
More recently, there’s been a lot in the last year-plus that’s given fans optimism that Walt Disney World will build a 5th (and even 6th!) theme park in coming years. This has really kicked into high gear in the last couple of months, after the company hosted Wall Street analysts and investors at Walt Disney World for an investor summit. That’s where they first revealed a plan to double investment to $60 billion in Disney Parks over the next decade.
June 1, 2024 Update: Following the settlement of a lawsuit between the parties over the former former Reedy Creek Improvement District, a development agreement has been reached between the Central Florida Tourism Oversight District (CFTOD) and Walt Disney World. Among other things, the jointly-drafted and agreed-upon development agreement provides for minimum investment amounts over the life of the 15-year agreement.
The development agreement commits the Walt Disney Company to invest up to $17 billion from Walt Disney World over the next 10 to 20 years. Under the terms of the deal, Disney is required to invest at least $8 billion within the first 10 years of the agreement. Disney also agrees to fund at least $10 million in affordable housing projects and create a local business hiring program that would award at least 50% of all construction work to Florida-based businesses.
The development agreement covers all of the land owned by Disney in Central Florida. One wrinkle about the agreement that has caught the attention of fans is that it authorizes a maximum of five major theme parks, which is one more than the current count (Magic Kingdom, EPCOT, Hollywood Studios, and Animal Kingdom). It also allows a maximum of five minor theme parks (think Blizzard Beach, Typhoon Lagoon, and other niche concepts) as well as nearly 1.3 million square feet of office space, 1.7 million square feet of restaurant/retail space and 53,467 hotel rooms.
This has fans excited, because surely this language was included purposefully because Walt Disney World has plans to build a 5th gate, right? RIGHT?! Wrong. The agreement simply gives Disney the autonomy to build a 5th park–keeping its options open–without having to revisit the development agreement. Seriously, this is like DisneylandForward all over again, with fans making huge assumptions that cannot conceivably come true.
The dead giveaway of this should be the fact that the development agreement also authorizes Walt Disney World to build three more minor theme parks…despite the company not even operating both of its existing water parks simultaneously. No one seriously believes Disney is going to build more other water parks or other niche concepts, so why get your hopes up over a theoretical 5th gate that Disney has–not once–evinced an appetite to build. We already know some of what the company plans to do in the coming decade. And none of it is a fifth gate!
The real story here is–or should be–that the Walt Disney Company and the state of Florida as well as the CFTOD have repaired their relationship and are working together again. This is hugely positive news for what the company actually plans to construct at Walt Disney World. (This is something we first discussed in Disney “Responds” to Universal’s Epic Universe–but it’s good to see forward momentum continue!)
Aside from that, there isn’t really any new-news here. Disney Parks Chairman Josh D’Amaro and CEO Bob Iger have hyped investment and “turbocharging” growth in Parks & Resorts over the last year. Even the amount isn’t new–although the $60 billion amount for all of Parks & Resorts has been talked up more, the company revealed $17 billion investment plans for Walt Disney World over a year ago.
Even with tremendous optimism for the future of the Florida Project, we still do NOT expect a 5th gate at Walt Disney World. First, because both Iger and D’Amaro have specifically said they want to expand the existing parks. During the many interviews the two have given that discussed plans for the future and bullishness on parks, they talked about capacity-expanding additions.
We discussed all of this in great length in Bob Iger Wants Big Expansions at Walt Disney World & Disneyland and again in Reimaginings Inside the Park and ‘Beyond the Berm’ Expansion at Magic Kingdom. There are no shortage of quotes from Iger and D’Amaro about reimaginings and new lands at the existing Walt Disney World parks. There are zero about fifth gates.
Iger and D’Amaro are careful and deliberate when speaking publicly, choosing their words carefully. If there were plans for new theme parks, they’d say as much. Instead, they repeatedly have invoked Star Wars: Galaxy’s Edge, Toy Story Land, and Pandora – World of Avatar as the blueprints for how Disney plans to expand its parks and “invest in increasing capacity” and “opportunity within these existing footprints to optimize.” Those words are pretty clear.
If that’s not enough for you, there are the concepts that have already been announced or teased. Walt Disney World has only confirmed one major expansion project, the Tropical Americas at Animal Kingdom. Beyond that, they’ve repeatedly suggested there are plans for Beyond Big Thunder in Magic Kingdom. They’ve also talked about World of Frozen and Wakanda lands coming to Disneyland and Walt Disney World–but not in new parks.
There’s really no need to speculate. D’Amaro and Iger have repeatedly and consistently shared the plan, and it is not for a fifth gate!
Fans are also looking at that headline $60 billion or $17 billion number and doing some dreaming of their own. To be sure, those are colossal sums of money. Taking just the $17 billion, which is conceivably enough for 5th, 6th, and 7th gates. That’s theoretically enough for roughly three new Shanghai Disneylands (~$5.5 billion upon opening in 2016).
However, there’s zero chance of a 5th gate at Walt Disney World costing that little unless it were done in the spirit of the OG Walt Disney Studios Park in France and, trust me, no one actually wants that mess. For one thing, construction isn’t as cheap in the United States as it is in China (that was also almost a decade ago).
Labor and material costs have skyrocketed and Disney doesn’t have a great track record of keeping costs in check. A new Disney theme park in Florida would easily cost $8 billion unless it were an absolute barebones, half-day park.
On top of that, this is all of the CapEx at Walt Disney World over the course of a decade. Even Disney could build a new park for $6-7 billion, that would be a big chunk of that total, and would necessitate CapEx reductions in the existing 4 parks as compared to the last decade.
At first blush, $17 billion seems like a ton of money, but it’s actually only slightly above the last decade at Walt Disney World when adjusted for inflation (it may not be above it at all when looking exclusively at construction costs). To be sure, there were a ton of awesome additions over the last decade–and it’d be great to get another 10 years of that–but zero new parks.
Building a fifth theme park at Walt Disney World would mean that the Tropical Americas and Beyond Big Thunder projects, which they’ve already said are happening, wouldn’t be able to happen. (Rest assured, they very much are happening…along with a few other major unannounced projects that’ll cost at least a few hundred million a pop.)
Still, many Walt Disney World fans think a 5th gate must happen for one simple reason: as an “answer” to Universal’s Epic Universe, the third theme park being built in Central Florida by Comcast. Many fans believe Walt Disney World needs to have a response to Epic Universe, and the only thing that can really compete with a new theme park is a new theme park.
In all likelihood, Tropical Americas is the next major project on the horizon (outside of ride reimaginings) and it’ll start in late 2024 and be done in 2026 or 2027. It appears increasingly likely that Walt Disney World is going to “sit out” 2025 and not try to compete with Epic Universe.
Assuming, for the sake of argument, that Walt Disney World had built a 5th gate and it also opened in 2025. At least when it comes to theme park fans or people wanting to do the hot new thing, Epic Universe and that fictional Disney 5th gate aren’t going to compete with one another–they’d both cannibalize attendance from the existing parks.
That’s a natural segue into a core point that Walt Disney World will only ever build another theme park if it won’t pull away from its existing gates. You may also hate to hear this, but Walt Disney World is not going to build another park to reduce crowds or attendance in its current parks. There’s no scenario where they’re going to spend billions of dollars to tread water–that doesn’t make any sense.
Walt Disney World will only build another park if it can increase per guest spending via vacation duration and add at least ~8 million new visits to Walt Disney World’s cumulative total in its first full year. That would be a difficult feat. The average American’s vacation is between 4 and 6 days long, and that average has been on the decline for the last couple of decades with Americans leaving a record number of vacation days on the table (there’s article after article about the shrinking American vacation).
Anecdotally, we’ve heard from many travel agent friends that the most common “answer” from clients to rising costs at Walt Disney World is decreasing length of stay. Rather than doing a full week or 6 days, they’re doing 4-5 and avoiding weekends. There’s actually indirect data to support this–look no further than the slowdown on Saturdays and Sundays.
With the duration of the average American vacation on the decline, adding more gates is a tough sell. After factoring in travel days, many Americans already don’t have enough time to experience all four parks plus Disney Springs or water parks plus whatever Universal’s parks might siphon away.
This is a problem because it necessarily means that a new theme park at Walt Disney World would cannibalize attendance from the existing gates, at least among a good segment of guests. If the majority of visitors to Walt Disney World don’t have another park day to add, building a fifth gate is a nonstarter. It’s easier to get more people to come to the current parks than to take the current demographic and have them add another day.
As always, there are outliers–and those of you reading this who measure your annual time at Walt Disney World in weeks are exactly that. But if you’re reading this, you already do not match the median guest profile for Walt Disney World, so let me stop you right there. You are very much above average. It’s important that we don’t confuse our own vacation time or preferences for the norm.
Then there are the logistical impediments or reasons why building a new theme park would be less desirable than expanding existing gates. Staffing shortages have been a hot topic for the last couple of years, and although they’re largely resolved in the parks, it’s still not perfect. It’s a tight labor market, with nearly two job openings for every unemployed person. The root causes of this are beyond the scope of this post, but the bottom line is that it’s unlikely to change in the Central Florida hospitality industry.
Whether the local labor market (not to mention the housing market, which is already pricing hospitality industry workers out–that’s the reason why Disney is helping to build affordable housing) can sustain not just one, but two more parks, is an open question. It’s not just these parks, either. There’s the $1.5 billion Evermore Orlando Resort, Area15, and dozens of other attractions and hotels that are under construction. All of these places need people to work at them.
Of course, Walt Disney World has the College Program and various other means of importing temporary workers from out of state–and that could certainly help provide the workforce necessary for a fifth gate–but thus far that has not been the case for their 4 gates in the last couple of years.
If Disney is going to allocate existing or additional employees to new developments, they’d probably prioritize timeshares and hotels over a theme park. There’s better ROI and less risk, and those are not nearly as resource-intensive. Personally, I think Disney is likely reticent to build new hotels in the near-term, but timeshares are full steam ahead.
When it comes to growing theme park attendance, the easier and more cost-effective solution is the one we’ve been seeing over the last several years: expanding the existing parks. Walt Disney World has already built out the capacity of its existing gates with attractions like Remy’s Ratatouille Adventure, the Guardians of the Galaxy coaster, TRON Lightcycle Power Run, and Star Wars: Galaxy’s Edge.
This approach of expanding the footprint of existing parks or replacing underutilized attractions is advantageous from Disney’s perspective because it keeps infrastructure costs lower. It also doesn’t require gambling big on a new, untried concept and having to throw more money at that in the future to boost its popularity.
With a new park comes new toll plazas, ticket booths, turnstiles, backstage facilities, roads, transportation hubs, and other infrastructure that already exists in support of the existing theme parks. These infrastructure expenses are not insignificant, and it’s difficult to justify their expenditures when the existing parks can be built-out without incurring all of these same costs.
Then there are the operating costs, which would also be higher with a new gate versus an existing gate with added capacity. New theme parks require more labor (see above) for staffing said toll plazas, ticket booths, turnstiles, transportation, and so forth. Simply put, expanding the existing parks is the conservative, cost-effective, and low-risk approach. It costs less for the company, and that means less expense to be passed on to consumers.
This brings us to the point that Walt Disney World should not build a fifth gate. Here, we’re switching gears from what will likely happen to what should happen. Frankly, Walt Disney World has no business thinking about another brand-new theme park anytime soon. I know this is going to get me some hate mail, but hear me out.
Fans love the idea of a 5th theme park because it’s a blank slate, capable of holding a long wish list of rides and lands. Instead of getting 1-2 rides here or there, we get a half-dozen new lands. I get it. A brand new theme park is sexy and exciting, and it’s fun to daydream about Florida DisneySea or whatever might be in your perfect park.
Don’t get me wrong–I would love to relive the feeling of setting foot in a brand new park that’s totally unfamiliar. There’s nothing like that–expansions absolutely do not compare! But I’m also a realist. It’s fun to dream, but the practical reality of a new theme park in the late 2020s or early 2030s would not be perfect or meet what you’re imagining; at best, it would open incomplete.
If this fictional fifth gate at Walt Disney World were on par with Walt Disney Studios Park (Paris), Disney’s California Adventure, or Hong Kong Disneyland when any of those opened, the experience would be utterly underwhelming. Building Shanghai Disneyland…as it exists today…in Florida, USA…in the year 2030 would cost at least $12 billion once all is said and done. Maybe more. Want Tokyo DisneySea? Say goodbye to pretty much the entirety of the $17 billion.
As exciting as that would be–and it’d be very exciting!–it’s difficult to advocate for that when Animal Kingdom is still a half-day park for most guests and in need of 2-3 more rides. When Disney’s Hollywood Studios needs more all-ages attractions so that its headliners don’t average 60+ minute waits. When EPCOT, even post-overhaul, needs another new World Showcase pavilion and reimaginings to a few rides at the front of the park.
And those are just the things that really should be done at the existing parks. That list did not include Beyond Big Thunder at Magic Kingdom. Not because I think it’s a bad idea, but because Magic Kingdom “needs” the least help. (It’s going to happen, regardless.) There are a ton of discretionary projects that could happen at the existing gates to really improve them, and Beyond Big Thunder is one of those.
Outside of the Dinoland plot, there’s a ton of unused or underutilized space in Animal Kingdom. That park already has great bones–now how about a couple of all-new (not replacement) lands–that turns it into a 1.5 day park? There’s endless potential at EPCOT. Backstage facilities could be relocated at Disney’s Hollywood Studios, allowing for the smallest park to become larger (and have an easier-to-navigate) layout. Imagineering is plenty capable of dreaming up tens of billions of dollars of fantastic ideas for the existing 4 parks at Walt Disney World.
If you’re not persuaded that fixing or building out the existing parks is the right course of action, I get it. The shiny new object (5th gate) is always going to be more exciting. But how about with this added to the mix: the infrastructure costs alone of building a new theme park would eat away at least $2 billion of that $17 billion. So unless you are a road and drainage enthusiast, those are sunk costs that would not enhance your vacation.
Stated differently, let’s say that if the company simply chooses to expand existing parks, we might get around $13 billion worth of new stuff, whereas we’d get $11 billion in total if there’s a new gate thrown into the mix. (I’ve already skimmed $4 billion from the top under the assumption that it’ll go to DVC/hotels or other non-attractions projects, regardless.)
For me, the answer is easy: I’ll take a maximization of the investment, and have that money allocated towards expanding the existing parks and reimagining rides that are currently underutilized or outdated. I know that’s not the exciting choice and might be an unpopular opinion. But the alternative is the current 4 gates stagnating for at least a full decade–and that’s assuming a new gate would be properly built-out in the first place, and wouldn’t require another decade to fix or expand.
As a Disney fan, I’ve lived through decades of stagnation and I don’t really want a repeat of that. From my perspective, the last decade was far, far better. Sure, I think everything took too long and a decent amount of money was poorly allocated at EPCOT. But at least part of that can be blamed on the pandemic, and hopefully that won’t happen again. If leadership coalesces around a clear vision for Walt Disney World’s 10-year plan, the fruits of that in the existing four parks could be fantastic.
The current parks are great, but they have a lot of untapped potential and room for improvement. I’d rather see billions of dollars invested into the current 4 parks than for them to be neglected for 10+ years. The good news, at least from my perspective, is that Walt Disney World fans don’t get a vote on this. My opinion and your opinion do not matter in the least–this is the route that Disney has already indicated it’s going to go.
Planning a Walt Disney World trip? Learn about hotels on our Walt Disney World Hotels Reviews page. For where to eat, read our Walt Disney World Restaurant Reviews. To save money on tickets or determine which type to buy, read our Tips for Saving Money on Walt Disney World Tickets post. Our What to Pack for Disney Trips post takes a unique look at clever items to take. For what to do and when to do it, our Walt Disney World Ride Guides will help. For comprehensive advice, the best place to start is our Walt Disney World Trip Planning Guide for everything you need to know!
Your Thoughts
Do you think a fifth gate is on the horizon at Walt Disney World? Would you like to see $10 billion of that $17 billion spent on a brand-new theme park, or would you prefer it spent on building out the existing 4 parks? Do you agree or disagree with our reasons as to why one is unlikely–or desirable–in the foreseeable future? Any other thoughts or commentary to add? Any questions we can help you answer? Hearing your feedback–even when you disagree with us–is both interesting to us and helpful to other readers, so please share your thoughts below in the comments!
Even decades before the demise of Reedy Creek Improvement District the ten year plan always mentioned suitable land for an additional one major park and three minor parks. it has nothing to do with availability of the funds to build these parks but whether there were sizable plots of land that could support the infrastructure required. Remember, this was swamp land. Not all of the original forty-seven acres can support the weight of a park. The 1982 Odyssey Resturant is close to a sink hole they couldn’t fill so a huge metal plate capped it off and it was turned into a small lake.
Good, they need to add more to AK and HS particularly and even Epcot before a 5th is considered
Tom! ctrl+F “uannunced”. Unacceptable. Jk it was a good read.
????
Thanks. Can’t believe spellcheck didn’t flag that…and I missed it when writing, editing, and updating this post. Oof.
I always enjoy reading your articles, although I’m pretty sure I finished “War and Peace” in less time that it took to read this one!
I still think adding a 5th gate makes a great deal of sense for the following reasons:
1) A The ‘Wow Factor’ of a 5th gate equals or perhaps even exceeds a 3rd park at Universal, more than piecemealing additions at existing parks would do. From a marketing perspective, a 5th Disney park would be the biggest Florida Theme Park News in over 20 years.
2) While you may be able to spread out additional crowds brought on by new lands within existing lands throughout the day, there will still be critical times when everyone will still be attempting to either arrive in the morning, or especially trying to leave at the end of the night. Just two nights ago it took my wife and I well over an hour to get onto a ferry boat after HEA. Adding an additional 10,000 or so more souls to that might make leaving at the end of the night a virtual impossibility.
3) Adding a 5th gate would disperse the daily “headcount” at WDW way more efficiently than shoving those same folks into the existing boundaries of the current 4 parks.
4) I’m no economist, but I have to think the ROI on a $7B investment into a 5th gate would certainly exceed the ROI on the same $7B investment increasing capacity at the existing parks.
I could go on, but those are just a few reasons why adding a 5th gate would make sense.
I think the reason why WDW won’t build a fifth park is that #2 and #3 is true; I suspect a fifth park would draw more guests from other WDW parks than from outside WDW, resulting in better balanced crowds in the short term. Based on that assumption, #4 is incorrect; #2 & #3 mean that a fifth park will draw more guests from other parks than from outside WDW, resulting in lower revenues per dollar spent (ROI). Given they won’t even open the MK at 8:30 am every morning, I don’t see WDW management focused on managing overcrowding like that.
As for #1, oldtimers like me remember the DUD factor of an additional half-baked park in the US; the last thing WDW needs to do right now is to actively advertise that they’re charging guests more for less. Even if you don’t remember DCA mark 1, the world’s biggest AP lounge, Hong Kong’s troubles have been noted by Tom.
I think opening a *good* fifth park in 15-20 years might become possible, particularly if the next ten years of improvements build up the non-castle parks in popular ways; that way only minor additions need to open while a good park is built.
I think I had a birthday during this article. WOOOWEE that was a loooong article
But soooooo informative.
they should stop building resorts. The parks are packed everyday, even in what once was the off season. I believe there are 25 resorts, then you add the good neighbor hotels. There are just to many people.
For planning purposes, the maximum should be considered a “best case” scenario rather than a “most likely” scenario. Having a max of 5 smaller gates sounds interesting until you realize that Wide World of Sports counts as the third small gate and something as small as DisneyQuest could count as the fourth. (I’m hopeful that Disney will keep an eye on Universal’s plans in Las Vegas, NV and Plano, TX, but I suspect a lot of smaller projects that would work elsewhere wouldn’t work as well at WDW.)
I think there’s a lot of positive arguments for making two-day theme parks. For example, it feels more exciting and fun to not be able to do everything in a single day because there’s so many things to do, rather than having less attractions with longer lines.
Reading this again, I think Disney owns 27.300 acres in Central Florida, rather than 17.300 acres.
So glad I enjoyed the early WDW parks in 1970s-1990s
before it all got so complicated .
Agree 100%. Update or reimagine some current attractions! Make it worth mortgaging my house for a week on vacay!
Tom, I agree 100%. I would much rather see the existing parks, especially Animal Kingdom and DHS, increase their offerings to make those parks a full day experience rather than add a mediocre 5th gate.
As much as I would like a 5th Park, I do not believe it will happen in my lifetime. I am in agreement woth you analysis (sadly.)
There was a big rumor years ago that the end of Western Way was going to be the 5th Park, a Villains Park, and marketed towards adults to compete with Universal. It was going to be opened later in the day to accommodate a night life feel and have more thrill rides. Pleasure Island would basically be moved there along with some sort of reimaging of the Adventurer’s Club. Eventually with the closing of Pleasure Island it was announced that Flamingo Crossing would be more 3rd party hotels and outlet shopping/entertainment to compete with Prime Outlets (need to keep guests on property). I’m sure the idea to expand certain lands instead of building a new park from scratch has been around since 2006/2007 since the space to build a 5th park went to building the disappointment that Flamingo Crossings has become. All of the very nice shops and dining were expanded in to Disney Springs instead of a 2nd shopping location. Perhaps if the 2008 financial crash didn’t happen the 5th park would have been built.
Looking on the FB groups for Horizon West, no one is too excited for the Disney housing project. More apartment complexes are being built instead of the shopping that was originally promised. Still waiting for a 2nd gas station to open. Maybe Disney could build one out that way first.
well, they did spend all that money on the star wars hotel fiasco.
Great article! Another part of this is the question of what would the fifth gate even be. At WDW, we already have a castle park, a studio park, EPCOT (science exhibit/museum + World Expo), an animal-themed park (zoo + conservation), and two water parks. I’m struggling to think of another good type of space strong enough to support an entire new gate. The long-proposed Villain-themed fifth gate feels tonally too one-noted to hold up an entire park; the enchanted forest concept seems to overlap with AK too much; DisneySea is a Japan exclusive and doesn’t fit well with the US theme park vibes; and I doubt Disney would even touch Disney’s America in today’s political climate. Without a strong enough theme that can clearly separate the new gate from the other four, building a fifth gate would just dilute what’s already there. Maybe this is just evidence that I don’t have the minds of Imagineers, but I cannot for the life of me think of a strong enough identity to give to this imagery Fifth Gate in Florida.
I think you’re probably overthinking it. If there were a concrete need for a fifth park that somehow couldn’t be satisfied by the existing gates, they’d come up with something. Even if it didn’t make complete thematic sense.
Heck, look no further than the development of the existing gates for that. New rides and lands don’t always go where they’d make the most sense–but where they’re most needed.
I could see them doing something like DisneySky and have it be a bunch of stories that, ostensibly, relate to the sky. Under the most liberal interpretation, things like dragons and outer space could technically qualify as being proper thematic fits.
I couldn’t disagree more. A villain theme would provide vastly more options than a “science” theme or “studio” theme. How many Disney villains can you think of? Certainly enough to provide more thrill rides than any current park offers. What would that take? 5 rides? It’s ludicrous to call that a difficult concept. Some comments on here almost seem like y’all don’t want a 5th park. And that’s baffling considering how stagnant and overpopulated the current parks have become. A multi billion dollar business can and should do better at meeting demand.
So many things to say about what needs to be fixed, replaced, and re-themed, but I will throw out some thoughts that are pure blasphemy to some and it’s about Star Wars. Disney has been unambitious and is missing a huge opportunity with Star Wars, especially when compared to how Universal is using Harry Potter. It’s upsetting to see the attention to detail Universal gave to Harry Potter and how they stuck to the source material verses what Disney has done with Star Wars. Disney basically created an unheard-of planet, built two rides, one which is “meh”, a tiny gift shop in which you are elbow to elbow with other people, tiny Ogas, and the failed star cruiser hotel experience. They ignored the original trilogy altogether. Star Wars is so much bigger than Harry Potter and could easily occupy its own park. Here is where the pitchforks come out. I think Hollywood lost its focus years ago. They should have closed it down and rethemed and renamed the entire park to Star Wars. The Tower and Rockin Coaster could have been rethemed. This would sadden me, but a well-done Star Wars Park would be one of the most popular on the planet. Toy Story would be the land beyond Big Thunder at the MK where it belongs. And no, Encanto does not “need” its own land, Chicken Little had a bigger box office and that was years ago.
“They should have closed it down and rethemed and renamed the entire park to Star Wars.”
I suspect Disney didn’t do this for the same reason Universal didn’t make a Harry Potter or Nintendo park: it narrows the audience too much. Big as those franchises are, entire parks devoted to them would have more limited appeal than parks with a broader range of options, even ones that are less popular than the flagship franchises.
Just look at Epic Universe, a park being built from the ground-up. There are some, ahem, questionable IPs in there with limited drawing power–especially as compared to Mario. But they help round out the park, so it’s not just Super Nintendo Park–which would have tremendous appeal for some people, but be written off entirely by those not into Mario and co.
So while Star Wars or Mario or Harry Potter bring an entirely new audience to Florida, they would also have more narrow appeal with a subset of the current audience. It’s a double-edged sword.
As for Encanto, it didn’t do so hot at the box office, but that was also coming out of the pandemic at a time when families still weren’t going to theaters. It has done incredibly well in terms of minutes streamed. I’m still not convinced it’ll stand the test of time and I probably wouldn’t build a land/miniland around it (yet), but don’t let the box office fool you–that only tells a small part of the story.
Sadly, I agree completely with your analysis. I’d add that many legacy rides and iconic guest transportation is in dire need of repair and immediate capital injection. In particular, the monorail is desperately in need of new vehicles. Whether this budget is padded to include these expenses or money taken from another pot, that’s significant cash that must be spent to keep guests safe. Any new expansion at Magic Kingdom will follow down the well worn path of the Fantasyland expansion ie a handful of new attractions and a pricey headliner themed restaurant to be enjoyed in 4 or 5 years down the road. Anything new will be welcome. But a 5th gate isn’t happening. ps juicing up Animal Kingdom is the most exciting part of all. Let’s hope the imagineers are actually allowed to shine. And their concepts actually built. No Joe Rohde makes many worried.
“No Joe Rohde makes many worried.”
There are still a ton of talented Imagineers. There are also a lot that could work at any design firm in the world, and aren’t uniquely skilled to work for Disney.
Regardless, it’s impossible to assess from the outside looking in. The current crop did make Rise of the Resistance–we’ll know what else they’re capable of when Zootopia and Fantasy Springs open.
A good way to think of it is as if Imagineering is the culinary team and Disney corporate is the restaurant patrons. Imagineering might whip up a great Michelin-star menu, but if the patrons keep ordering frozen chicken tenders…well, there’s only so good those can be!
At this point I don’t think much is going to happen anywhere in domestic Disney for two reasons: 1. Disney, in the USA at least, is in a period of leadership, legal and identity disarray and isn’t focusing on or addressing anything very well, and 2. Despite the way they present their finances, from what I’ve seen elsewhere, I flat don’t think they have the disposable cash and I also don’t think that with interest rates as high as they are, they will be financing much capital improvement in the near future.
My question regarding reimagining/expansion is if Bob and Josh have any plans that are not based on (over)utilizing existing movie IP. In this way the theme parks seem to operate (or want to operate) much like the studios: “This movie wasn’t a failure? Let’s plan 4 sequels, a live action or two version, two Disney+ shows per year, and some theme park attractions.” The problem for theme parks is that while shows and movies can be shut down part way through production, or written off, it is much more expensive to deal with park and hospitality misreads (like, say, a Star Wars resort).
My idea would be to take some joint inspiration from the American Experience and Eisner’s Virginia gate and make an American Historic Adventureland by Big Thunder. This could flow from Liberty Square (bring back the muppets!). But it will never happen.
To each their own, but in looking at our fractured political landscape today, I think the company dodged a bullet by not building Disney’s America. I can only imagine how controversial that’d be in what it does or does not present, what would have to change, etc.
Walt Disney World’s limited handling of American history and politics is brilliant, and even that upsets a lot of guests. Probably best to leave well enough alone.
I am not actually sure that Disney will build another park anywhere in the next decade. California the Disney Forward is a longterm xoning plans plan and I think its expansion for hotels, dining/shops and parking first and then maybe some attraction land expansion plans(Avatar like Bob wants if its not redwood/grizzly area etc). Disneyworld youve explained.
Paris is a similar situation to Disney World. Hollywood Sudios still has to go through the painfully slow expansions and do something with some of the pads later lots of the Disneyland Paris needs improvement.
Hong Kong I understand there is land but attendance and politics means it might not happen. Shanghai just went through an expansion but is still less then 10 years old. Plus I am not sure disney really wants to be commiting to that part of the world atm for lots of reasons politics between US and China, stockmarkets not seeing as much value in the area post pandemic, etc.
Tokyo-well I am never going to say OLC wont throw money at a project to get something done if they really really want it if Disney Springs is a big success then maybe you could see a start by end of the 10 year period but that has problems with land cost etc mean it would be difficult.
Of course I could be wrong and Disney might have contracts to start 2nd or 3rd Parks in China/Hong Kong or Paris I dont know about but I see it as being an expansion in park instead of a more parks decade.